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RT America
Presents

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The dictionary defines Zeitgeist
as the general intellectual,

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moral, and cultural climate of an era.

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And even though the 21st
century has forced humanity

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into so many different fractured elements,

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there's an inescapable need to unify,

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to ensure a future for our species.

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It's with this in mind that the
Zeitgeist Movement was formed:

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as a collective call to
challenge the global status quo.

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And next month on October 4th in Los Angeles

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the organization will host its 4th
annual Zeitgeist Media Festival,

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which has traditionally brought together
artists, activists and musicians

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to enthusiastically embrace the
solutions to the global problems we face.

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Earlier today I was joined by the founder
of the Zeitgeist Movement, Peter Joseph.

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I first asked him why the themes
of his festival are an integral

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to the revolution of consciousness.

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[Peter Joseph] Activism has
been the cornerstone of ...

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development, social development,
experimentation,

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technological development,
all of these things have interweaved,

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all the great scientists of the past,
that have made

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massive contributions have also
been free thinkers and great artists.

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From Arthur C. Clarke,
who had basically invented

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satellite communication was also,
as you may well know,

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one of the greatest non-fiction writers and

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quite prolific in his
view of the future world,

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to Albert Einstein who played
the violin and Nikola Tesla.

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There is a deep-seated
experimentation in art needless to say

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as you well know,
and that bridges open-mindedness,

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that bridges creative thought,
experimentation,

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courage of course, which is something
that's long lost in our world

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when it comes to be willing
to risk your identity,

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risk your reputation to do
something different, experiment.

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So the Zeitgeist Media Festival
in a lot of ways is a parallel

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to our intellectual day,
Z-Day as it’s called or Zeitgeist Day,

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which occurs in March of each year,

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which is a very intellectual day,
highly organized

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as far as trying to present
solutions to global problems.

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Very heavy, often depressing,
as you might understand

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considering the state of the world,

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and so we try to balance
it in the fall of each year

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with the Zeitgeist Media Festival.

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It’s an inspirational type
of event and I encourage

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anyone out there to come out if
you’re in Southern California.

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- I’m really sad I’m missing
it this year because it really was

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such an amazing event when I was there;
it was incredible.

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I encourage everyone to definitely
check it out if you’re in the area.

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And let’s talk about the
Zeitgeist Movement as a whole Peter.

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You famously created those three
mind-blowing viral documentaries

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breaking through some of
those most dominating myths

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that keeps humanity stunted,

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which spawned an international
organization pushing

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for an alternative future.

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Briefly talk about what the
Zeitgeist Movement is all about.

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- Sure.

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The Zeitgeist Movement is a global
sustainability advocacy organization

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and what that means is we deal
with three primary issues:

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public health, ecological sustainability,
and social stability.

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And clearly all of those
intertwine in a systems context.

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And I’ll just jump to the end realization.

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If we alter our basic socioeconomic system,
the underpinning

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of everything that we do -
we can call it market economics,

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we can call it capitalism,
we can even go deeper to address

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the actual foundation of what
those words and what this system

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actually organized out of -

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if we take that and we modify it a certain way,

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we can resolve all of the major
problems we have in the world today.

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From poverty,
to the propensity towards conflict,

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to the growing and developing mental illness,

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to the huge lapse of public health,
to these enormous flaws.

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We don’t need to live this
way anymore if we simply

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obtain the type of efficiency
and industrial practice

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that we’re now capable of doing
through technological development.

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And that’s the big realization.

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And if anyone wants to learn more about that

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they can read the book that’s
been written that's free online

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called 'The Zeitgeist Movement Defined'

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or they can go of course to the
Zeitgeist Movement’s website

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thezeitgeistmovement.com and see

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hours and hours and hours of
lectures and general media

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on this subject.
But I would add one more thing,

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is that all the problems
we see in the world today

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are not going to be resolved
within the framework

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of the current socioeconomic model.

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It’s a very bold statement,

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but that unfortunately is the conclusion
that’s drawn by the Movement

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with an immense amount
of supporting evidence,

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and until we start to address this
core source base root problem,

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we have a lot of running in
circles to do unfortunately.

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- Right, you’ve said that activist groups

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fighting for their respective
causes working within the framework

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of that system is failing.
- Right.

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- It’s basically because they’re
merely patching the problem.

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It’s mostly fruitless unfortunately.

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Explain the difference between
categorical and systems thinking

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and how people CAN take
effective direct action.

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That’s a great polarized qualification:

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categorical thinking versus systems thinking.

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I’ll jump deep just for a moment, you know,

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we evolved with a 5-sense
perception and we are very tangible.

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we want to palpably understand and
perceive but it’s also very limited.

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We think categorically.

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We identify things by objects
and words and subjects,

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and we tend to organize our
sense of causality categorically

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in a very narrow or I would say
truncated frame of reference.

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And this has permeated just
about every major social facet

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from the way we think about
the legal structure to the way

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we think about economics of course.

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Even of course as you mention activism which

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everyone seems to really mean well,

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they really want to resolve problems,
they're going to their state legislatures

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to try and get legal
legislation in place to say

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stop climate destabilization,
stop the resource overshoot that is dramatic

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(it’s been estimated
we’ll need 27 more Earths by 2050

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to meet demand of the 9 and
a half billion people coming),

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and I’m sure you’re very aware of all
the other social and ecological issues

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that pertain to this. And these resolutions
are trying to use a system that,

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in the interpretation of the Movement
in which the "systems" awareness,

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is actually flawed in and of itself as well;

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is actually completely vulnerable
to the wrong propensities,

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which is essentially the
nature of the market system

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and its influence to stop this
type of interest in efficiency,

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preservation and sustainability.

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Efficiency, preservation and sustainability

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are the enemies of the
current socioeconomic system.

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Now that’s a slight deviation.
Systems thinking,

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which I’ll jump to in
more of an intense manner,

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has to do with the largest causal
technical reality you can conceive of,

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which wasn’t in our
awareness in early evolution.

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It was all purely tangible. It took
the scientific method to come forward,

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to start to realize say for
example dynamic equilibrium:

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to look at a forest,

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and instead of cutting the
whole thing down and realizing

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that it’s not regenerating fast
enough based on the consumption of it,

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to actually to be able to measure this,
to be able to measure the planet,

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to be able to measure energy consumption
versus resource availability.

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These are basic fundamental
sustainability and efficiency aspects

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that you’ll see throughout, anyone
that's involved in the technical sciences.

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And sadly enough our social system doesn’t
have any of those qualifications built in.

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The legal system - I’ll throw
that one out there as a final point

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as again this contrast
between categorical thinking

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and systems thinking -
the legal system is explicitly based

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on the idea of humans'
"free will" and their "decision"

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as though there’s no other influences,

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to make this or that choice that may
or may not be socially offensive.

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So when we throw people in jail,
is that a solution to anything?

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And statistically speaking
most people that go to jail

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come out with a higher
propensity to commit more crimes.

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So clearly it doesn’t work in the long run,

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and it’s obviously not
addressing the system consequence

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and anyone that you talk to in the basic
public health sciences will tell you that

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the leading cause of crime
and violence is deprivation.

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What’s the leading cause of deprivation?

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Social imbalance, inequity.

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So if you want to stop a lot of these

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huge negative tendencies and
violence and aberrant behavior,

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the best solution at this
point is to reduce dramatically

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class inequality, and give people
what they need to limit deprivation.

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So there’s a good example.

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- Incredibly enough I found
the most amazing statistic

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that exemplifies exactly what
you’re saying. Right now Peter,

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there are 356,000 Americans with
severe mental illnesses in prison.

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That’s 10 times the amount than
in state psychiatric hospitals

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which is an incredible statistic.

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How does that play into the
concept of structural violence

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and how much of the current system
necessitate that crime and poverty?

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- Well there’s a few angles on that.

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You can compare countries that have
different levels of class imbalance

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and then compare their
public health outcomes.

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I encourage people to read-...

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there’s hundreds and hundreds
of studies on this issue.

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There’s one book called 'The Spirit Level'
by Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett

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that I encourage you to research,

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which comprises the
majority of this research.

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And what they find is that there’s a

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massive increase in mental illness,
there's a massive increase

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or I should say decrease in education levels,

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a massive increase in violence,

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The vast majority of negative
public health attributes increase

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in societies that have
massive wealth imbalances.

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So in America which has-...

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Well, as a one brief aside, it is noted that

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due to cost efficiency in the state,

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they pretty much cut all mental
health services in the 1970s

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and decided that the prisons would
be the new mental health facilities.

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So that is a point of influence,
but that of course is a deeper,

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excuse me, a more shallow link in the chain,
that leads to this.

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Clearly all of the imbalance and shame

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and inequality,
which has a deep emotional impact,

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generates all of these factors;
statistically proven, it’s not a conjecture.

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So anyone that questions that
should go out and look into this.

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If we don’t take a systems perspective,

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nothing gets resolved; we run in circles.

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Even the criminal propensity;
everyone’s obsessed

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with criminal politicians and corruption.

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The analogy I use is that

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you can stomp on the ants

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that come out from under your refrigerator

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and keep stomping on them and spraying
them and trying to get rid of them,

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or maybe you can remove
the spoiled produce or food

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that’s behind the refrigerator
that’s actually causing them to come.

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And that’s what this society doesn’t do.

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It doesn’t resolve any of its problems and,

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to add one more punchline to that,

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it’s not profitable to resolve
any problems in this society.

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If peace and sustainability and efficiency,

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these are things that if achieved,
create a nice

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equilibrium where little action is required.

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And that is again the antithesis

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of what our economic system demands,
especially at this stage.

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Given the unemployment,

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it needs problems in order
to keep persisting with GDP,

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employment, growth, etc.

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- I just don’t understand
why people can’t see the link

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between that structural violence
and the millions of deaths,

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hunger, poverty, inequality-...

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- I will add one more thing since
I don’t want to pass this up;

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it’s a very dramatic statistic.

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In one of the more seminal works
in structural violence in 1976,

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public health authors figured out that

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back then there were 18 million
deaths that were caused a year.

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I suspect it’s much higher now.
18 million deaths a year.

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And that’s what, 34 years later?

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That’s about 700 million deaths
that have been caused unnecessarily.

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That outpaces the deaths of every dictator,

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every war in the 20th century. This is-...

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I mean we talk about terrorism when people
are freaking out right now over ISIS.

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And, as you know very well,

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the statistics of any
American or any in the West

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dying of terrorism is about
as nominal as you can get.

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We’re not focusing on
the car death epidemic

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that’s a true public health issue.

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We’re not focusing on people
that simply die of mere allergies

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and trying to help them to
avoid these types of things

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or get them into some type of medical
condition where it doesn’t happen.

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The spectrum, the relativism

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of - the distortion of this relativism -
is truly mind numbing.

237
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If anything, anyone,
people walk away with this interview is

238
00:11:25,261 --> 00:11:28,061
really stop to think about what
you see in the media as important,

239
00:11:28,338 --> 00:11:31,483
and then ask yourself statistically,
what is really important to public health?

240
00:11:31,593 --> 00:11:34,535
What is really important to
reducing human suffering?

241
00:11:34,695 --> 00:11:37,483
and what you see in the media
is just a big dog-and-pony show

242
00:11:37,593 --> 00:11:40,916
for ulterior motives. So I’ll stop at that.

243
00:11:41,027 --> 00:11:43,630
- Yeah, it is amazing.
I mean the fear-mongering,

244
00:11:44,067 --> 00:11:46,455
the 9/11 fear-mongering still today and,

245
00:11:46,680 --> 00:11:49,575
I mean it’s basically- it’s very
obvious that the military industry complex

246
00:11:49,690 --> 00:11:52,276
needs this manufactured enemy continued.

247
00:11:52,430 --> 00:11:54,566
First it’s Al-Qaeda,
then it’s ISIS, what’s next?

248
00:11:54,867 --> 00:11:56,375
It’s always going to be something Peter.

249
00:11:56,523 --> 00:11:59,218
Let’s talk about how capitalism
of course is unsustainable,

250
00:11:59,341 --> 00:12:02,553
predatory, and you say it’s
a contradiction unto itself.

251
00:12:02,676 --> 00:12:05,686
But you also say it’s not the source
of the problem, it’s merely a symptom.

252
00:12:05,993 --> 00:12:07,513
Elaborate on why.

253
00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:13,298
- You usually get a labeled really rapidly
when you start to criticize capitalism,

254
00:12:13,476 --> 00:12:16,744
given the decades of propaganda

255
00:12:16,861 --> 00:12:20,547
and the kind of educational
bias you have in traditional

256
00:12:20,923 --> 00:12:23,526
educational circles:
high schools in America and the West.

257
00:12:23,895 --> 00:12:25,741
And it’s assumed that if
you’re not for capitalism,

258
00:12:25,852 --> 00:12:29,329
which they block out as a
particular socioeconomic ideology

259
00:12:29,433 --> 00:12:31,076
(again in this truncated framing,

260
00:12:31,187 --> 00:12:33,304
they don’t look at the system
reality of how it emerged)

261
00:12:33,538 --> 00:12:35,563
they assume that you’re a
either Marxist or a communist;

262
00:12:35,987 --> 00:12:38,953
these things instantly
go into people’s minds.

263
00:12:40,140 --> 00:12:42,566
The first thing to point out is
that it’s completely narrow

264
00:12:42,670 --> 00:12:45,753
to even to decide that type of fact
because capitalism is a symptom

265
00:12:46,178 --> 00:12:48,566
of a larger deeper problem

266
00:12:48,676 --> 00:12:51,981
that has happened in our
socioeconomic understanding,

267
00:12:52,098 --> 00:12:55,273
which goes back in my view,
at least in a formalized sense,

268
00:12:55,420 --> 00:12:56,966
to a man named Thomas Malthus

269
00:12:57,070 --> 00:12:59,175
who was hired by the
British East India Company

270
00:12:59,286 --> 00:13:01,323
to do the first global survey of resources.

271
00:13:01,833 --> 00:13:05,409
And basically Malthus said that humans...

272
00:13:06,338 --> 00:13:08,516
humans multiply exponentially

273
00:13:08,664 --> 00:13:12,326
while resources are acquired
or regenerate geometrically.

274
00:13:12,775 --> 00:13:14,461
So in this ethic he said

275
00:13:14,578 --> 00:13:17,095
there are always gonna be more
people than there are resources,

276
00:13:17,255 --> 00:13:18,800
there are always gonna be poor,

277
00:13:18,984 --> 00:13:20,990
and there are always gonna
be people that are basically

278
00:13:21,107 --> 00:13:24,500
gonna have to die for the
benefit of the rest of the world.

279
00:13:24,830 --> 00:13:27,852
You couple that in with a
century and a half later

280
00:13:27,963 --> 00:13:30,553
when Darwin comes around,
writes a very profound book

281
00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:33,901
about basic evolution.
It was quickly bastardized

282
00:13:34,590 --> 00:13:38,535
by the more militant
interests in society that said

283
00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:41,180
“Oh! This proves everything
that we thought all along:

284
00:13:41,298 --> 00:13:44,104
social Darwinism, survival of the fittest.”

285
00:13:44,406 --> 00:13:46,104
We live in Malthusian society,

286
00:13:46,307 --> 00:13:48,972
we now have social Darwinism that
says only the strong survive.

287
00:13:49,341 --> 00:13:52,227
Boom! You have the entire basic ethic of war

288
00:13:52,781 --> 00:13:54,726
instilled right into the model,

289
00:13:54,947 --> 00:13:57,729
and you have the entire
basic ethic of capitalism

290
00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:02,363
instilled right into the value system
of the social architecture that says:

291
00:14:02,713 --> 00:14:04,233
there’s not enough to go around.

292
00:14:04,420 --> 00:14:06,935
Therefore some will have to compete,
well everyone will have to compete,

293
00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:08,646
and some are gonna lose tremendously

294
00:14:08,775 --> 00:14:10,313
and some are gonna win tremendously,

295
00:14:10,430 --> 00:14:13,280
and it’s all natural.
Let’s just let it happen.

296
00:14:13,460 --> 00:14:15,760
And that’s clearly the state
today with the 100 billionaires,

297
00:14:15,870 --> 00:14:17,667
the 100 billionaires
right now that can resolve

298
00:14:17,932 --> 00:14:20,701
global extreme poverty four times over,

299
00:14:20,849 --> 00:14:23,692
and the 3000 other billionaires
that have now emerged.

300
00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:27,040
And we’re gonna see that
number increase through time,

301
00:14:27,150 --> 00:14:30,289
with 43%, up to 46% based on some estimates,

302
00:14:30,750 --> 00:14:32,775
of the wealth of the world owned by 1%.

303
00:14:33,050 --> 00:14:36,806
This is considered a virtue
in the deep-core ethic

304
00:14:37,050 --> 00:14:40,473
and which is also deeply and
atrociously offensive and wrong.

305
00:14:40,615 --> 00:14:42,953
Now the final thing I’ll
add is this contradiction

306
00:14:43,064 --> 00:14:45,889
that’s happened throughout the
evolution of capitalism itself.

307
00:14:46,418 --> 00:14:50,566
Capitalism defends itself as being
a scarcity-focus system, right?

308
00:14:50,732 --> 00:14:52,246
It says: What? But there's scarcity!

309
00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,532
We have to - it comes this Malthusian premise -
there’s not enough to go around.

310
00:14:56,180 --> 00:14:58,326
And some people distort this to say there's
"infinite" wants,

311
00:14:58,460 --> 00:15:02,024
that human beings,
given their own free interests,

312
00:15:02,135 --> 00:15:05,975
would want everything, which is another
completely ludicrous social projection.

313
00:15:06,541 --> 00:15:09,070
So it defends scarcity as its reasoning

314
00:15:09,175 --> 00:15:10,264
but then what does it do?

315
00:15:10,406 --> 00:15:12,523
It goes out and it promotes
infinite consumption.

316
00:15:12,683 --> 00:15:14,904
Because consumption is what
drives the entire thing.

317
00:15:15,193 --> 00:15:18,676
Consumption is what keeps the money
moving between all the major actors.

318
00:15:18,849 --> 00:15:21,624
If you have less consumption,
it’s like the gas pedal on a car.

319
00:15:22,172 --> 00:15:24,916
If you have less consumption,
you have more unemployment,

320
00:15:25,050 --> 00:15:26,283
you have reduced growth.

321
00:15:26,787 --> 00:15:30,129
So it’s completely schizophrenic,
do you see my point? It’s insane.

322
00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:33,384
- That’s amazing.
You just broke it down pretty well Peter.

323
00:15:33,636 --> 00:15:35,716
But of course a common
protest about it is that

324
00:15:36,730 --> 00:15:39,796
human nature is competitive, you know.

325
00:15:40,380 --> 00:15:43,175
I keep hearing this over and over
again and I wanted you to address that.

326
00:15:44,166 --> 00:15:47,396
- Sure. Human nature IS competitive,
when it needs to be.

327
00:15:47,938 --> 00:15:52,246
Human nature is many things;
our neural plasticity is unbelievable.

328
00:15:52,356 --> 00:15:53,550
If there’s anything that

329
00:15:54,196 --> 00:15:57,273
neurological science has
shown us in the past 50 years

330
00:15:57,384 --> 00:16:01,747
is that our ability to adapt and
change is absolutely incredible.

331
00:16:01,876 --> 00:16:06,941
And to quote Stanford neuroscientist
and anthropologist Robert Sapolsky,

332
00:16:07,704 --> 00:16:12,941
“Our nature in part is not being
particularly restricted by our nature.”

333
00:16:13,286 --> 00:16:15,107
And this is profound, and what I think

334
00:16:15,220 --> 00:16:17,304
what happens in this system is
people think it’s human nature

335
00:16:17,415 --> 00:16:21,138
because it’s all they see. And there’s
what I call a primal provocation.

336
00:16:21,316 --> 00:16:24,892
If you have this Malthusian
socially-Darwinistic basis over the society

337
00:16:25,064 --> 00:16:27,864
and you’re born into it,
it’s constantly pinging

338
00:16:27,993 --> 00:16:30,578
that element of your
nature that is aggressive,

339
00:16:30,824 --> 00:16:32,147
that does look out for itself,

340
00:16:32,332 --> 00:16:34,910
that drives self-interest
in this tribalistic need

341
00:16:35,033 --> 00:16:36,763
to disregard the well-being of others.

342
00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:39,101
So there’s no mystery

343
00:16:39,218 --> 00:16:41,316
as to why people are
continuing to behave this way,

344
00:16:41,532 --> 00:16:44,080
but to confuse it with something
that is considered to be empirical

345
00:16:44,190 --> 00:16:48,418
to our condition that is inescapable,
is absolutely ridiculous indeed,

346
00:16:48,738 --> 00:16:51,606
and any qualified neuroscientist
will tell you the same.

347
00:16:51,796 --> 00:16:54,387
- Of course more common objections
to this line of thinking

348
00:16:54,658 --> 00:16:57,969
is that the Zeitgeist Movement
is just repackaged Marxism,

349
00:16:58,190 --> 00:17:00,492
and it’s gonna turn into
some technological tyranny.

350
00:17:01,107 --> 00:17:02,775
How is it different, how can it maintain

351
00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:05,089
people’s agency, ownership,
control over their lives

352
00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:07,218
while establishing a civil rights imperative?

353
00:17:09,876 --> 00:17:11,544
Well, back to my prior point,

354
00:17:11,655 --> 00:17:14,246
there's that knee-jerk reaction
to Marxism which tends to happen

355
00:17:14,350 --> 00:17:16,621
by people that don’t even
know what Marxism is/was!

356
00:17:17,341 --> 00:17:19,366
They see that little encyclopedia blurb that

357
00:17:19,476 --> 00:17:21,796
they basically read in high school
and they think they understand

358
00:17:21,907 --> 00:17:24,480
what happened in that
historical period of time.

359
00:17:24,763 --> 00:17:28,258
I’ll address that one briefly.
Anyone that says it’s Marxism or communism,

360
00:17:28,436 --> 00:17:31,556
needs to remember that communism and
Marxism were based on a moral philosophy.

361
00:17:32,535 --> 00:17:34,849
Marx talked about a lot of things,
some of it actually very

362
00:17:34,953 --> 00:17:36,609
cogent and proper and right,

363
00:17:36,824 --> 00:17:40,196
but he also proposed solutions
that were very much erroneous

364
00:17:40,412 --> 00:17:41,956
and very unscientific.

365
00:17:42,307 --> 00:17:44,590
And if you read the Communist
Manifesto by Marx and Engels

366
00:17:44,701 --> 00:17:47,858
you’ll find it has absolutely NO comparison
to what the Zeitgeist Movement promotes.

367
00:17:48,170 --> 00:17:49,901
The Zeitgeist Movement -
back to my original statement -

368
00:17:50,010 --> 00:17:53,316
it’s about public health,
it’s about social sustainability,

369
00:17:53,587 --> 00:17:56,578
excuse me, ecological sustainability
which is social sustainability,

370
00:17:56,916 --> 00:18:00,196
and social stability and all of that

371
00:18:00,313 --> 00:18:03,686
I would say,
is really about social sustainability.

372
00:18:04,210 --> 00:18:06,024
And when you put this
train of thought together -

373
00:18:06,135 --> 00:18:07,650
there’s that term "train of thought" -

374
00:18:07,969 --> 00:18:10,941
you have a ground-up realization
based on the evidence that exists

375
00:18:11,058 --> 00:18:13,938
of what actually makes a working society,

376
00:18:14,233 --> 00:18:16,547
what actually will assure future generations-

377
00:18:16,652 --> 00:18:18,141
which we by the way share the world with.

378
00:18:18,258 --> 00:18:20,713
We don’t just share the world with
the 7 billion people we have right now,

379
00:18:20,929 --> 00:18:23,101
we share the world with
our kids and our grandkids,

380
00:18:23,458 --> 00:18:26,092
we have to keep that in mind.
And the more we are irresponsible,

381
00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:29,021
the more it hurts everybody in the future
just as much as it hurts everybody right now.

382
00:18:29,452 --> 00:18:32,769
And this type of awareness has no
resemblance to communism in any facet,

383
00:18:32,873 --> 00:18:35,249
it’s just that knee-jerk
reaction that people have.

384
00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:37,630
As far as the freedom neuroses ...

385
00:18:39,690 --> 00:18:41,526
As far as the freedom
neuroses that people have,

386
00:18:41,630 --> 00:18:43,175
that’s a knee-jerk reaction once again,

387
00:18:43,476 --> 00:18:45,193
to this propaganda of the market that says that

388
00:18:45,304 --> 00:18:48,332
people are free, and they can achieve
and they have infinite social mobility.

389
00:18:48,443 --> 00:18:50,843
First of all,
you need to debunk the fact that there’s no

390
00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:53,440
real freedom in the
market complex whatsoever.

391
00:18:53,560 --> 00:18:55,113
It is structurally coercive.

392
00:18:55,476 --> 00:18:59,181
It is a coercive system that
puts certain people in power

393
00:18:59,298 --> 00:19:03,113
in a completely dictatorial manner,
as a system consequence,

394
00:19:03,335 --> 00:19:06,178
a system orientation that deeply separates

395
00:19:06,406 --> 00:19:09,089
owners and workers -
this is the core characteristic -

396
00:19:09,409 --> 00:19:12,049
and in that equation there
are very limited options

397
00:19:12,153 --> 00:19:16,123
the farther you go down
on the stratified ladder.

398
00:19:16,547 --> 00:19:19,883
And if you’re like the majority of
people that exist in this lower platform,

399
00:19:20,018 --> 00:19:22,369
your freedom is so incredibly restricted,

400
00:19:22,473 --> 00:19:24,793
your health options are
so incredibly restricted,

401
00:19:25,003 --> 00:19:26,664
and has been proven by statisticians,

402
00:19:26,947 --> 00:19:29,833
the ability for social elevation

403
00:19:29,975 --> 00:19:33,070
has been increasingly limited
as time has moved forward,

404
00:19:33,286 --> 00:19:34,849
as this system has compounded itself.

405
00:19:34,953 --> 00:19:37,261
So I ask people that question:
What freedom are they expecting?

406
00:19:37,563 --> 00:19:39,304
See, it’s really a loss of creativity.

407
00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:41,815
They only know what they
perceive and what they feel

408
00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:43,446
and they’ve been brainwashed to think

409
00:19:43,550 --> 00:19:47,212
that walking into a store and choosing between
40 different types of cereal is freedom,

410
00:19:47,507 --> 00:19:49,649
while they have two political
parties that pretty much

411
00:19:49,858 --> 00:19:52,166
ignore everything the
public says to begin with.

412
00:19:52,381 --> 00:19:55,132
This isn’t freedom,
and I think when people research the Movement

413
00:19:55,249 --> 00:19:57,292
they’re gonna understand what
true freedom actually means.

414
00:19:57,495 --> 00:20:00,080
And that’s the freedom not
to be held down to a slave job

415
00:20:00,190 --> 00:20:01,747
(which is what it is at this point in time).

416
00:20:02,220 --> 00:20:04,455
The vast majority of
occupations in this world

417
00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:06,861
are not necessary and
counterproductive to human health,

418
00:20:07,430 --> 00:20:10,135
and actually having freedom
away from the property system,

419
00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:12,061
which is another point we can talk about,

420
00:20:13,420 --> 00:20:15,058
a different point of this address,

421
00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:17,421
to actually have the freedom to
get away from the property system

422
00:20:17,563 --> 00:20:20,763
and to move around and not have the
"liability" of ownership.

423
00:20:20,873 --> 00:20:22,381
And that’s a very radical term,

424
00:20:22,630 --> 00:20:25,593
that goes completely contrary to
this consumption/materialistic

425
00:20:25,753 --> 00:20:27,101
vanity-oriented society,

426
00:20:27,206 --> 00:20:30,073
but I really believe that the
true freedom of our future will be

427
00:20:30,356 --> 00:20:34,135
NOT having property,
NOT having ownership, having access!

428
00:20:34,252 --> 00:20:36,566
We promote an access society
in the Zeitgeist Movement

429
00:20:36,707 --> 00:20:39,236
where people have access to
everything that they need,

430
00:20:39,575 --> 00:20:43,046
not hoarding property and value arbitrarily

431
00:20:43,243 --> 00:20:45,298
in this archaic system we have now,

432
00:20:45,446 --> 00:20:48,313
which is destroying the
planet and human psychology.

433
00:20:48,584 --> 00:20:49,963
- And let’s talk about mechanization.

434
00:20:50,073 --> 00:20:53,673
You mentioned how technology is
destroying the market system as well.

435
00:20:53,796 --> 00:20:55,975
How? Because it seems to me
like technological innovation

436
00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:57,870
is constantly creating new markets.

437
00:20:59,107 --> 00:21:00,910
- That seems to be what’s happening.

438
00:21:01,378 --> 00:21:04,018
The defense, the Luddite fantasy defense,

439
00:21:04,190 --> 00:21:06,400
is that we have displaced labor

440
00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:09,058
in proportion to creating new jobs.

441
00:21:09,261 --> 00:21:10,916
This is absolutely absurd.

442
00:21:11,329 --> 00:21:13,963
In 1929 they actually wanted to put a halt -

443
00:21:14,104 --> 00:21:17,427
during the Great Depression -
they wanted to halt (this is in Congress),

444
00:21:17,833 --> 00:21:20,098
halt technological development,

445
00:21:20,449 --> 00:21:23,772
because they were so
terrified and were so shocked

446
00:21:23,993 --> 00:21:26,153
by what was happening by the early stages

447
00:21:26,264 --> 00:21:27,821
of mechanization back then.

448
00:21:27,975 --> 00:21:30,375
They literally tried to pass a
law that said no one can apply

449
00:21:30,486 --> 00:21:32,541
or create any more technology
that relates to labor.

450
00:21:32,700 --> 00:21:36,307
If you can imagine that. Now if that isn’t
a telltale sign of what was in store.

451
00:21:36,770 --> 00:21:39,692
Now there has been dramatic
improvement in the goods and services

452
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,418
which is based on technology, not capitalism.

453
00:21:42,578 --> 00:21:44,412
If I hear one more person
say to me that: “Oh,

454
00:21:44,590 --> 00:21:47,003
capitalism created your smartphone”
or “capitalism did all...”

455
00:21:47,113 --> 00:21:51,606
No, capitalism is a delivery system and
a financing system of its own creation,

456
00:21:51,815 --> 00:21:55,292
and there’s no other alternative to
using this system in the world today.

457
00:21:55,452 --> 00:21:57,803
It’s only technology and
technological innovation

458
00:21:57,910 --> 00:21:58,929
that has created these things;

459
00:21:59,058 --> 00:22:01,660
capitalism is just along
for the ride at this point.

460
00:22:01,938 --> 00:22:02,953
So that out of the way,

461
00:22:03,230 --> 00:22:06,264
technological unemployment is the core driver

462
00:22:06,412 --> 00:22:09,901
of all unemployment in the world,
if you take a system perspective.

463
00:22:10,098 --> 00:22:12,787
Forget policies of
government and all this stuff

464
00:22:12,892 --> 00:22:15,101
that seems to come into play,
our monetary policy and

465
00:22:15,815 --> 00:22:19,230
injections to give big business more
money so they can hire more people.

466
00:22:19,347 --> 00:22:23,255
All of that is completely superficial in
again that categorical narrow thought.

467
00:22:23,686 --> 00:22:25,716
It’s actually the movement of technology,

468
00:22:25,821 --> 00:22:27,390
the development I should say of technology,

469
00:22:27,507 --> 00:22:30,000
throughout time that has changed everything!

470
00:22:30,178 --> 00:22:32,449
that has moved every single labor role.

471
00:22:32,596 --> 00:22:35,003
And the big thing now is that
technological development

472
00:22:35,113 --> 00:22:37,126
is exponentially increasing faster

473
00:22:37,273 --> 00:22:40,012
than the human mind can redevelop
to gain new occupations.

474
00:22:40,129 --> 00:22:41,649
And then the big question becomes:

475
00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:43,876
Why do we need new occupations?

476
00:22:44,283 --> 00:22:47,421
Why can’t we reach a point,
which we already really have,

477
00:22:47,686 --> 00:22:52,510
where we have such an incredible range of
activity within what we’ve developed,

478
00:22:52,929 --> 00:22:55,083
and progress itself becomes actually

479
00:22:55,292 --> 00:22:58,947
enduring what we’ve already
generated in living life,

480
00:22:59,175 --> 00:23:02,061
as opposed to this neurotic
need for so-called "progress"

481
00:23:02,221 --> 00:23:04,233
which I could talk about
the neuroses of that word

482
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:05,938
at great length as well.

483
00:23:06,147 --> 00:23:09,304
Punchline being is that this
exponential increase in technology

484
00:23:09,464 --> 00:23:12,344
will create more cost
efficiency for corporations,

485
00:23:12,523 --> 00:23:15,040
it will become cheaper to automate over time,

486
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:17,323
and they will, one way or another,

487
00:23:17,433 --> 00:23:20,240
because the basic ethic of
profit-seeking corporations,

488
00:23:20,369 --> 00:23:23,181
displace human labor over and over again.

489
00:23:23,347 --> 00:23:24,240
What does that do?

490
00:23:24,369 --> 00:23:26,664
That removes purchasing
power from the society

491
00:23:26,812 --> 00:23:28,756
and that entire cyclical system

492
00:23:28,890 --> 00:23:31,132
is going to slow down on its own accord.

493
00:23:31,249 --> 00:23:33,040
It’s called the
contradiction of capitalism.

494
00:23:33,150 --> 00:23:34,738
It’s one of the strongest, and

495
00:23:34,849 --> 00:23:37,507
it’s going to happen and
you’re going to see a lot of

496
00:23:38,024 --> 00:23:40,060
loss of growth over the course of time,

497
00:23:40,184 --> 00:23:43,827
inevitably because of these
conflicting incentive structures.

498
00:23:44,707 --> 00:23:45,655
So I hope that make sense.

499
00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:48,295
- Right. And what’s so,
I guess the biggest tragedy of all

500
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:51,040
is that America is one of the
most overworked countries,

501
00:23:51,163 --> 00:23:55,175
people are just working so hard to try to
achieve this unattainable American goal.

502
00:23:55,610 --> 00:24:00,055
Or people put money as the
highest attribute of worth,

503
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:02,756
I mean the most important attribute here.
What’s the first step

504
00:24:03,064 --> 00:24:07,076
in the shift of this warped value
system Peter? How can we start this?

505
00:24:07,901 --> 00:24:10,264
I think it already is happening but I mean,
I just...

506
00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:14,578
Yeah... Going back to that point about

507
00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:17,021
what it means to be successful in this,

508
00:24:17,144 --> 00:24:19,620
this basic social value orientation we have,

509
00:24:20,196 --> 00:24:24,043
that’s been distorted by
advertising that we value each other

510
00:24:24,153 --> 00:24:26,535
based on our perceived success
because of materialism.

511
00:24:26,886 --> 00:24:29,772
There’s a great shift that’s
happening amazingly enough and

512
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:32,123
it’s a system pressure
that’s generating this,

513
00:24:32,233 --> 00:24:34,966
and people are finally
starting to be offended

514
00:24:35,298 --> 00:24:38,012
by the gross excess lifestyles of the world.

515
00:24:38,246 --> 00:24:41,138
They see the climate destabilization,
the resource overshoot,

516
00:24:41,243 --> 00:24:44,233
they see all the social problems,
the tremendous wealth imbalance.

517
00:24:44,455 --> 00:24:46,953
And all of that glory that used to be

518
00:24:47,273 --> 00:24:50,104
being super-wealthy as the sign of success,

519
00:24:50,621 --> 00:24:52,307
that is starting to dissipate.

520
00:24:52,584 --> 00:24:54,910
That is to me a very powerful marker,

521
00:24:55,089 --> 00:24:58,830
because that implies that it’s
really about balance in the world

522
00:24:58,972 --> 00:25:02,135
that is going to create a high level
of social respect and integrity.

523
00:25:02,356 --> 00:25:04,387
People will look at each other and say:
“Wow, that guy

524
00:25:04,580 --> 00:25:06,467
is completely self-sustaining,

525
00:25:06,578 --> 00:25:09,058
he lives in absolute equilibrium
with his environment.

526
00:25:10,184 --> 00:25:12,713
"His footprint (in other words) is
the lowest I’ve ever seen!”

527
00:25:13,101 --> 00:25:16,966
That is a hero;
that is the highest level of status.

528
00:25:17,563 --> 00:25:19,163
As far as how this transition works,

529
00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,101
that type of value system
has to come into play.

530
00:25:21,286 --> 00:25:22,763
And I think again, it’s on pace.

531
00:25:22,984 --> 00:25:27,212
Then concrete projects need to be set
in motion; I'm talking about building.

532
00:25:27,458 --> 00:25:29,070
As difficult as it is,

533
00:25:29,821 --> 00:25:32,190
you have to start to build
this type of ideology,

534
00:25:32,301 --> 00:25:34,726
well excuse me, this type of society,
it’s not really an ideology.

535
00:25:34,836 --> 00:25:36,356
You have to build this framework,

536
00:25:36,523 --> 00:25:39,489
and show people what’s possible
to expand that creative realm,

537
00:25:39,778 --> 00:25:43,236
and then they’ll start to
realize that they can do this.

538
00:25:43,340 --> 00:25:45,520
And I advocate virtual building projects.

539
00:25:45,649 --> 00:25:47,827
I have a project called the
Global Redesign Institute.

540
00:25:47,930 --> 00:25:50,160
The Movement has it;
I actually have a few of these projects,

541
00:25:50,276 --> 00:25:53,169
I'm going to organize into an offshoot
of the Movement over the course of time,

542
00:25:53,458 --> 00:25:55,415
dedicated only to technical construction,

543
00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:57,421
to show the world what’s
actually technically feasible

544
00:25:57,544 --> 00:25:59,790
and a lot can be said on that issue.

545
00:25:59,901 --> 00:26:01,630
As far as transition step-by-step,

546
00:26:01,772 --> 00:26:04,067
we have to get away from this
“labor for income” system.

547
00:26:04,301 --> 00:26:07,070
I propose what Martin Luther King proposed:

548
00:26:07,187 --> 00:26:08,744
a universal guaranteed income.

549
00:26:09,070 --> 00:26:11,544
And I say that people should start to chop

550
00:26:11,747 --> 00:26:13,636
the wealth of the top one percent

551
00:26:13,778 --> 00:26:16,264
and start to give it to
the rest of the population

552
00:26:16,424 --> 00:26:18,260
at this point as a form
of wealth distribution.

553
00:26:18,460 --> 00:26:20,221
Ooh, a lot of people hate that,
we got the socialism,

554
00:26:20,338 --> 00:26:21,840
I can hear them yelling at me right now.

555
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:23,710
But what else do we do at this stage?

556
00:26:23,858 --> 00:26:25,846
We have to have some type
of resolution to stop

557
00:26:26,092 --> 00:26:28,923
this type of increase in
poverty and destabilization,

558
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,852
and that type of idea is not irrational.

559
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,356
And I think that any billionaire out there
with any type of social consciousness

560
00:26:34,473 --> 00:26:37,015
should be doing this themselves.
As I stated earlier,

561
00:26:37,190 --> 00:26:39,686
the top 100 billionaires
out there can resolve

562
00:26:39,803 --> 00:26:41,815
extreme poverty four times over.

563
00:26:41,970 --> 00:26:43,009
I mean that’s incredible.

564
00:26:43,790 --> 00:26:46,024
And there’s numerous
other statistics that show

565
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:48,436
how much more capable they could
be if this type of resource,

566
00:26:48,590 --> 00:26:51,015
a monetary allocation,
was done to the general population.

567
00:26:51,360 --> 00:26:54,541
That aside, universal guaranteed income
would raise the standard of living

568
00:26:54,658 --> 00:26:57,649
of the vast majority of humans in America
and on the planet if it was applied,

569
00:26:57,901 --> 00:27:00,787
removing an enormous amount
of public health stress.

570
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:02,953
You would see an absolute
[de]crease in violence,

571
00:27:03,064 --> 00:27:05,618
you would see an absolute [de]crease
in mental health disorders,

572
00:27:05,870 --> 00:27:07,944
you would see an absolute
[de]crease in just about everything

573
00:27:08,050 --> 00:27:10,590
that relates to general
public health concerns,

574
00:27:10,707 --> 00:27:13,120
if we did that. Then as another
step (and I could go on and on,

575
00:27:13,230 --> 00:27:14,566
so you stop me when you want me to),

576
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:21,003
you start to create technical applications
in local cities for food production.

577
00:27:21,200 --> 00:27:23,458
Localized food production
through automated means,

578
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:26,640
not financial means,
we’re not financing corporations.

579
00:27:26,923 --> 00:27:30,560
You take the city government,
and you get them to build

580
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:34,640
hi-tech food creation systems
through aquaponics and aeroponics-

581
00:27:34,750 --> 00:27:36,953
it’s in the book,
that’s 'The Zeitgeist Movement Defined.'

582
00:27:37,060 --> 00:27:38,596
I outline this specifically

583
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:41,636
because of the power of this;
traditional our agriculture is over

584
00:27:41,740 --> 00:27:44,984
and it’s a massive detriment
given how much water it requires.

585
00:27:45,095 --> 00:27:47,538
70% of worlds water -
we have a water shortage in California -

586
00:27:47,686 --> 00:27:49,987
70% of the world's water is going towards

587
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:52,067
traditional industrial agriculture,

588
00:27:52,221 --> 00:27:56,960
and only about a 10th of
that would be required

589
00:27:57,138 --> 00:27:58,640
if we were to do this

590
00:27:59,526 --> 00:28:01,809
through advanced means that
are out there right now.

591
00:28:01,981 --> 00:28:03,563
So you make food free!

592
00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:06,504
You give it away through technical
means again, not subsidization.

593
00:28:06,812 --> 00:28:09,483
And then you begin this transition,
where you go step-by-step

594
00:28:09,667 --> 00:28:12,363
to making things free for
technical reorientation.

595
00:28:12,470 --> 00:28:14,006
Eventually you're gonna hit a halfway mark,

596
00:28:14,332 --> 00:28:17,224
where you've offset all the
labor displacement, excuse me,

597
00:28:17,384 --> 00:28:19,735
all the income displacement
because of unemployment,

598
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:23,538
by these free mechanisms,
and of course universal guaranteed income.

599
00:28:23,710 --> 00:28:25,846
And if you follow that train of
thought which I’m gonna stop here,

600
00:28:25,993 --> 00:28:27,840
you can do a step-by-step process. Now,

601
00:28:28,104 --> 00:28:31,033
will corporate and the corporate
in the state government

602
00:28:31,140 --> 00:28:32,818
(which of course is a corporate institution),

603
00:28:32,923 --> 00:28:35,550
will they facilitate or want that?
Of course not.

604
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:39,316
And that’s where the massive
necessity for global activism

605
00:28:39,420 --> 00:28:41,692
towards this type of technical
resolution is required,

606
00:28:41,987 --> 00:28:44,461
and that’s why I recommend people
to look into the Zeitgeist Movement.

607
00:28:44,615 --> 00:28:46,460
It’s not an easy question; I wish I had

608
00:28:46,572 --> 00:28:49,606
a complete plan but there are too
many factors that come into play.

609
00:28:49,766 --> 00:28:52,473
But we have to do something because
everyone’s lives are at stake.

610
00:28:52,793 --> 00:28:55,606
- Right, I mean, if we don’t want
a bloody revolt, a bloody revolution,

611
00:28:55,710 --> 00:28:57,556
we need to start really acting here Peter,

612
00:28:57,661 --> 00:29:01,236
because the old guard is not gonna
give up this old system without a fight

613
00:29:01,501 --> 00:29:02,892
and without a lot of deaths,

614
00:29:03,220 --> 00:29:06,153
and it’s time for us to step up to the
plate really for the future of humanity.

615
00:29:06,260 --> 00:29:07,243
Thank you so much Peter.

616
00:29:07,612 --> 00:29:10,676
theZeitgeistMovement.com,
everyone check it out.

617
00:29:10,824 --> 00:29:12,941
Incredible to have you on as always.

618
00:29:13,784 --> 00:29:15,273
- Thank you Abby, it’s an honor, thank you.

619
00:29:15,415 --> 00:29:16,289
- Thanks so much Peter.

620
00:29:16,726 --> 00:29:20,110
theZeitgeistMovement.com